Got called out for making too substantive of edits to established articles, but that's not what got him in trouble. What got him his 24-hour tempban was ignoring Sorts' stop order.
[edited:] Welp, the guy just doesn't get it. Permabanned with agreement from Mann and several Senior Staff in chat.
I'm not an admin, of course, so this is mostly "FWIW". But here goes.
Okay. I agree that this guy was annoying and deserved disciplinary action for thumbing his nose at us. Not something we should have to tolerate and not something we want to encourage.
BUT.
Why did we permaban this guy.
Two things:
(1) Standard procedure is to enact a 7 day ban, not jump straight from 24 hour ban to permaban.
(2) It's silly and reactionary to permanently ban someone for being silly and reactionary in just one instance, however egregious. If the dude came back after their 7-day/1-month/whatever time out and still acted like that, fine. But jumping straight to a permaban is something we should in no way be doing. That is one reason WHY we decided to do the 7-day thing.
But I see you didn't even give the guy ANY time-out first, be it 24 hours or 7 days. Just jumped straight to permaban.
I mean, I was there for the first part of this. The guy got under my skin too. That much is obvious from the thread, I'm sure. :P
I also understand that disciplinary action is undertaken at staff discretion, and we/you were well within your rights to take this action. and yeah, if this guy was serious about Leaving Forevurrr Omg, it won't really matter! Honestly, I don't care about this guy, nor do I take seriously his butthurt splosion. I agree with the content of Mann's last post to him in that thread. But in my opinion, this still just ain't good practice or good precedent to set.
agreed solely because according to the rules, that is procedure.
permaban can pretty easily be modified to 7-day ban, as per the currently established rules
i would not be sorry to see him permanently gone, but since that's not what we ourselves have said are the rules, 7-day it should be, until and unless he gives reason to make it longer.
however: since, so far as i know, banning means removing a person's membership, and then permitting them to re-apply again after a certain period of time….it will, in effect, BE a permaban, if he is serious about never coming back, yes, since he will then never even come back to re-apply.
Why I permabanned: when I did so, Patrick was demonstrating a complete disregard and lack of respect for authority and procedure. The rest of this thread is showing that it wasn't the wrong decision (if just done a bit prematurely— mea culpa there). moose, I had given him a twenty-four tempban and was in the process of implementing it when he responded to my post with his Whatever Fuck You outburst. So it wasn't straight from nothing to perma. Just 24 to perma (see above).
The processes and mechanics of user account management will be greatly improved at the new site— like issuing tempbans with a single click (or three, as long as it's not dozens).
Oh my god he is seriously ban evading.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-140153/experiment-log-455#post-1552419
Under the account DoctorMengele.
Feel free to read my above post as my strongly felt suggestion for what we should do in the future, rather than specifically regarding this guy, because he is basically trolling at this point. I do enough white knighting for problem users srsly
Yeah, permaban the fucker. If they can't learn to ultimately accept our decisions and move on with their lives and try to work in harmony with the site, I don't want them around.
if your reading this your gay
Be careful, he'll start PMing you. The really crazy ones usually do, if you insult them.
EDIT: This post means I am seconding the permaban.
Okay, he's replying a lot, so I am going to start deleting posts and copying them here. Will edit this post as I delete. Screencaps will be forthcoming as well.
My deleting of these posts was supported by Scantron and yoric, falling under our magical rule-of-three.
In reply to Mann's post here:
Re: Mod post
DoctorMengele 30 Aug 2012, 23:40 GMT-07Oh no, your time was wasted? That's a damn shame. Now you know the feeling.
I know how things work here. Why would I have even brought up my mistake in chat in the first place if I didn't? I followed your procedure; I was shot down instantly for it. I shouldn't have to invest my time somewhere else on this site to build up an arbitrary reputation just so I can fix an error-laden article with things that were literally asked for on its discussion page, but were left lying in wait for years, abandoned by its author without explanation. (Which goes against something in the rules, although they might not have been present when NekoChris was active. But go ahead, ignore this and tell me to read the rules for the sixth time.) I did very trivial edits on the actual scp article; sure, the page works without them, I suppose, but its not like it was hurt it in any way and only helped keep things consistent. I've seen these sorts of things be done countless times by other members, but somehow having a longer joindate makes them more correct than me, apparently.
I wasn't "pissy" because I was told I did something wrong; rather, when I conversed with Photo originally I actually thanked her for her time and for not acting in the same manner as any other wiki would have. I see that Photo however does not represent the majority of people on this site, as evident now. Instead, I was angered because I was being treated like a child, and even compared to one, for doing absolutely nothing that should have brought such disrespect. I didn't go behind anyone's backs; there's absolutely zilch I could have gained from doing so. And it wouldn't make much sense for me to do such a heelface right after I myself had reported the mistake that I had done. Photo never told me what admins she conversed with, so there was no way of knowing Waxx was not included with them. I chose something convenient considering I was already with him; instead I'm told that I "crossed the line" and it "was not just a matter of laziness." Yeah, okay. I guess I'm supposed to deal with that insinuation "in good faith"?
You fucked up a bit? That's a complete understatement. Well, not really you specifically but the admin team in general. What you brought up I never actually had a fault with, which is why I never brought it up anyway. Clearly there were some communication issues here; both between the admins and with me. But I shouldn't have been treated unfairly the way I was simply because of my joindate. That's straight up elitism, plain and simple.
And yet again, my intentions are misunderstood. You try to portray me as some rebel against the cause, unable to fathom procedure or how things are performed on this site. You couldn't be farther from the truth. Just because I was a less than a day old account doesn't mean I was new to this site at all. And assuming so is insulting at the very least. I'm judged maliciously and said to have acted conivingly, going around peoples backs and trying to get my way. In reality, I tried to improve an article that I thought had great potential and didn't realize I would have to jump through multiple hoops to do so, all the while getting chastised in a condescending manner. Somehow it seems you identify that in the negative way, saying I didn't deal with you in good faith and that I can't imagine why you do things the way you do.
Well yes, when I try to break my back for something and end up with nothing to show for but insults towards me and a wasted effort, I'm not going to be exactly thrilled about it. And if the tables were reversed, I'd hope you would come to the same conclusion as well. How about looking at things from my point of view, instead of simply saying that I hadn't seen them in yours?
To Quikngruvn: Yeah, your passive aggression certainly puts you in a good light. Definitely not giving off a neckbeard vibe at all. And feel free to ban me again since I clearly was presenting a threat to the site by saying that a 24 hour tempban would be a wasted effort on your part. Especially considering I hadn't just said that I wouldn't be continuing myself with the site, or anything. (Hopefully you'll notice that this paragraph is completely sarcastic. Surely if I treat you the same way you treat me, everything will be fine, right?)
In reply to my post here:
Re: Mod post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 01:07 GMT-07You caught me there, deadlymoose. I'm definitely trolling by writing a six paragraph essay on how I was treated/banned unfairly and responding to something that was accusing me of things that I didn't do, without a way for me to even defend myself.
You yourself said here that the permaban was unnecessary. I appreciate the concern, even though you spoke so negatively about me.
In reply to Lee Jones' post here:
Re: thedeadlymoose
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 01:34 GMT-07Uh.. Okay. That doesn't make very much sense at all considering your post gave nothing of the sort.. in fact it seemed more of a troll response than anything else.. but I suppose you can bullshit that excuse all you want. I fail to see how illuminating how horribly I've been treated is immature, but I suppose it takes a certain kind of person to place oneself in another's shoes. Both in yours and mine.
And no, I'm not trying to get some emotional response. Writing me off as that is the actual immature thing to do. (And before someone thinks that the name Doctor Mengele, the infamous Nazi madman, is also some sort of troll maneuver; it just happened to be the first name that popped in my head.)
Lee Jones then posted (and I deleted) the following:
Re: thedeadlymoose
Lee Jones 31 Aug 2012, 01:40 GMT-07Look, buster, I WILL NOT get into this with YOU, so BACK OFF!! You are acting incredibly immature. The way you're acting will get you permabanned for sure. You say you don't care? That's funny, if you don't care, why did you evade the ban? There is no call for labeling me a troll. In my opinion, you are the troll.
In reply to the above:
Re: thedeadlymoose
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 01:46 GMT-07I didn't want to get in an argument with you at all, but since you acted so nicely to me.. Please explain how "Boy, he was pissy wasn't he?" does not try to incite an emotional response. And please explain where I've been trying to incite one, since I'm getting called a troll left and right.
And since I just love repeating myself again and again, I don't care for people that accuse me of things wrongfully after permanently banning me, again wrongfully, and then don't provide me a way to defend myself at all. If that's not immaturity, then I guess we have different definitions of immaturity (since we clearly have different ones for trolling.)
To respond to Scantron in my discussion page (WHICH I'M NOT EVEN ALLOWED IN, HENCE WHY I'M HERE) "Yeah, permaban the fucker. If they can't learn to ultimately accept our decisions and move on with their lives and try to work in harmony with the site, I don't want them around." So basically if we don't see eye to eye and I don't think alike with you, I'm mincemeat for the slaughterhouse? How is that ethical at all?
Lee Jones replied again, which I am also going to delete:
Re: thedeadlymoose
Lee Jones 31 Aug 2012, 01:49 GMT-07I don't why I'm answering you, but, you are being pissy. Ask everyone else if you disagree.
I responded to Lee Jones thusly, in a post which I am going to delete because it's nested under another post I'm gonna delete:
Yet Another Mod Post
thedeadlymoose 31 Aug 2012, 01:47 GMT-07Lee Jones:
Don't feed the trolls.
Just let this guy fart around til the admins wake up and he's inevitably banned again.
Feel free to take this to PMs, but don't reply any longer to this thread, and please don't start another one on this topic. That goes for anyone else too. No more bashing of our resident ban evader. Do that in IRC or in PMs, not in this thread. Further conversation in this thread should be about the experiment log only. Thanks!
Lee Jones responded:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
Lee Jones 31 Aug 2012, 01:54 GMT-07Of course sir. My apologies again. My short fuse temper getting the better of me again.
Mengele/Patrick also responded:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 01:55 GMT-07Go ahead and delete my posts then, like you said. I wouldn't have even put them here if I was given the right to actually respond in my own discussion page.
And to what you said as "responding a lot", I responded only when I get misidentified, wherein lies the original problem. Lee Jones also responded more than me by numerical count, but I suppose that's okay because he's another member that has existed for more than a day.
And then yoric chimed in (fyi, just assume if I'm copying the post, it's getting deleted)
Look! Rails!
pooryoric 31 Aug 2012, 02:04 GMT-07OH MY GOD THERE IS A NAZI IN THE FORUMS.
Go away.
Back on topic per moose's thinger: I think this article is awesome the way it is. in fact, a couple of the things doctor silly wanted to edit have always struck me as interesting bits of narrative conceit.
Specifically, the vanishing team member. I always assumed that was a manifestation of the SCP effect that slipped under the Foundation's radar. I like the subtlety.
Granted, I may be reading too much into it.
(I asked yoric to repost this, but I think his internet crapped out. :P)
Mengele responded:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 02:08 GMT-07You're hilarious. I suppose because everyone treats me as a troll, that gives you, and Lee Jones also, the right to troll around with me? Does anyone not recognize that this is exactly the kind of elitism I was talking about before?
I'll tell you right now; you're reading too much into it. How exactly would SCP 455 effect an exploration log made hundreds, if not thousands, of miles away? I suppose everyone's head canon is their own right. But nothing Chris made even hints at this; the number of errors that are present in his story only serve to suggest that it's nothing more than a simple mistake.
Yoric's response:
Rails, dude, rails. This is a train, choo choo.
pooryoric 31 Aug 2012, 02:11 GMT-07No, no, look, bear with me here. What if 455 somehow actually removed number ten from not only the team, but the team's collective consciousness? How cool is that?
I realize it's not, like, nodded to in the article, but I assumed that was the point. The Foundation missed it, because the SCP effect made them not notice.
Now, usually, I wouldn't consider that as a possibility, but it's really exactly the kind of thing I'd expect from a piece by nekochris.
Mengele, no longer trolling, but gettin' deleted anyway:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 02:15 GMT-07While I agree that that is an interesting concept, I don't really think it fits in this story. Unless it somehow managed to have that effect on everyone involved; HQ, T3L, Ripcoil, the technician, written record, etc.
Yoric:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
pooryoric 31 Aug 2012, 02:16 GMT-07I may actually have to write that Foundation Tale now. Eventually.
Mengele:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 02:18 GMT-07Certainly. I suggest numbering it as exploration number 2, as there's already a #1 and a #3. Of course, such thoughts got me yelled at on the main article, but our experience/joindate prove different.
Me:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
thedeadlymoose 31 Aug 2012, 02:23 GMT-07Yoric this whole thing is gettin' deleted, so repost downthread in a new comment thread pls
Mengele:
Re: Yet Another Mod Post
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 02:26 GMT-07And why is it getting deleted? Because I'm involved? You don't have to become communist China over here (or dare I say it, Nazi Germany) by deleting everything that I've said and anything I said it with.
lolfascism
(BTW, Mengele, since I know you're reading this: the reason it's being deleted is because you're ban evading and stirring drama. You weren't stirring drama in all those posts but they're parented by another comment that I'm deleting either way.)
And he just keeps going:
DoctorMengele 31 Aug 2012, 02:59 GMT-07
Congrats, you deleted something that was beneficial to the article. I suppose both me and yoric share something now. Nothing I said before was to stir up any drama; I just want answers and I want fair justice, and nowhere else could I find them. This however, I would interpret as such a dramatic post. But the only reason I post it is because I know you're going to delete it, and post it on that thread. I hope something comes out of this more than what I'm expecting. I'm not going to wait a year to make a ban appeal just to clear up something a year before or to try to return, especially when it was agreed upon that the permanent ban was wrong. But I want to make light the numerous problems that have occurred that would most likely go unnoticed otherwise:
1. I was accused of doing things that I did not do, and was not apologized to for them. Normally I would not care, but given all the events combined this is inexcusable for anyone that can consider themselves professional, especially admins/mods/etc.
2. I've been called a child when all I wanted to do was help. That's like handing someone your abridged version of something that you spent time on, only for them to rip it up in front of you and then spit in your face. Then telling you to work on another abridged version before you can even get permission to ask if you can make that original abridged version.
3. I've had to repeat myself numerous times. I've also been told to read the rules numerous times. Admins shouldn't be doing that; I had to read the rules to even apply for this site. I've also referenced them several times. I think I have them down, thanks.
4. I've been labelled as a troll, when I honestly cannot assert enough that I am far from it. I've also been trolled by other, more senior members. They get away with it scott free. I'm being continuously threatened with another permaban.
5. After banning me, Mann posts on the discussion something that not only broke a mod's stop order, but also had absolutely nothing to do with the article and was only a jab at me; something I wasn't even allowed to defend myself from. That's immaturity at it's finest. You say you were going to PM me; nothing prevented you from doing so afterward. It's not like my account was deleted, it was just removed from the SCP membership. You could have easily continued that PM, although with a different message. Instead you made the post to publicly denounce me; to make me look inferior while you guys reigned supreme. It was full of inaccuracies. The post still stands now, even though it still has absolutely nothing to do with SCP-455 Exploration Log 1 and goes against the decision to stop the discussion, something I was permanently banned for. And now you know why I continued to post, even though I said I was done; hopefully the hypocrisy is evident in what Mann did.Please don't disappoint me as I've been seeing so far. (Oh, and don't just screencap this either, please. I'd like it to be posted.)
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele1.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele2.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele3.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele4.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele5.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele6.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele7.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele8.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele9.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele10.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele11.png
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/local--files/thedeadlymoose/mengele12.png
Wow, this was a longass post.
I was honestly just trying to rerail the dipshit; my idea wasn't terribly important, though I can repost it if you want, I guess.
Anyway.
At this point, I feel that it is thoroughly appropriate to consider the step of reporting this individual to wikidot for repeated sockpuppetry and ban evasion, as well as trolling both in discussion and through the defacement (defacizing? part of speech fail) of multiple pages. A nice IP ban from wikidot entirely should sort things out for him.
Also, because I know you're reading this: wank wank wank wank wank wankwankwank wank.
Woo-hoo, two for one! DoctorMengele has been permabanned since he was really Doctor Patrick evading his ban.
I'd put something witty and/or scathing here, but it just ain't worth the effort.
wait wait wait wait
the guy who was leaving forever because we were mean to him evaded his ban?
Seriously?
Back again as 'Mister Mustard'
So what you're saying is that it sounds right for an HQ to lose track of it's own number of people. And that a perfectly normal human being would use the phrase "Sweet Dapper Jesus of the Gentleman's Club"? You're overlooking numerous things. The radio chatter makes this look like it's some stereotypical elite squad tv show with it's own cheesy lines; not an exploration log.
And yes, you might notice the similarities between my and Doctor Patrick/Mengele's writing. That's because I am him. I notice that everything I said was again completely ignored; a common practice here I guess. The things I brought up were overlooked and forgotten; "surely if he's evading a perma ban, whatever he's saying must be wrong!" That's a horrible way to manage a wiki. Call me a troll all you want. It won't make it true, and it won't make what happened right. Because it wasn't.
And to what they say in my discussion page: When you try to call me out on things that aren't true after banning me, to save face, I'm not going to just stand by and let you do that. But sure, say that it's facetious and that I "must have the last word". Not like you haven't been completely misreading/ignoring everything I've been saying up to this point anyway.
Post has been deleted, user has again been removed from site.
Admin, SCP Wiki
For the record, "Sweet Dapper Jesus of the Gentleman's Club" is one of my all time favorite phrases on the site.
And it looks like he was back as TheContagiousWorm just now, since Quik's user page got defaced. Guy is kind of a tool.
"WELL FOUNDATION. YOU MADE IT SO EASY. SO VERY VERY EASY." - dimensionpotato
Apparently the correct procedures to follow for someone who feels they have been wronged is to go into long public rants, violating site rules in order to continue ranting, and then to attempt to deface the site.
Oh yes, that will show them.
User also made a bunch of apparently random reverts. They've all been undone, just making a note of it.
You know, for someone who apparently doesn't care or want to be on the site, he's putting a lot of time and effort into this.
Wow. I leave for three days and I miss all the fun stuff.
Vandalizing Quik's stuff? Wow.
