djkaktus responded to a closed staff post (see Durandal's thread here) to reply to a user who had done the same:
If you actually knew anything about management (and I do, with half a decade of manager experience in medicine) then you'd know you don't just throw things out. You keep comprehensive records of everything, and only toss them after a significant amount of time has passed.
Roget replied to tell him not to do that.
He was overly-dickish to a post on 049's page:
What an insightful and thoroughly useless wall of text. You've done well to ensure everyone knows the absolute best of your capabilities in a single post, and it is not encouraging.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-203252/scp-049#post-3797791
This was in response to this post by arcademanluke01:
The SCP foundation was built on mystery. You arnt suppose to know the whole story behind the SCP. There is suppose to be minimal information that drives a large mystery into the SCP. This re-write is far too overdone. Far too much information and the entire thing is written like a satire. He's just a edgy teenager. Sure you left some mystery in there but you completely ruined him personally. His unwillingness to talk and provide context and information make him far more mysterious and creepy. Now he seems like an outgoing teenage girl. I think this except just explains it all "Nonsense. We are all men of science. Fetch your coat and show me to my quarters, doctor. (Gestures with pointed stick) Our work begins now!" That is the cringiest thing i have ever read. I cannot read that without cringing. Instead of the introverted doctor he seems like he's come in for his new job at the SCP foundation. May i mention the cane? The very same one and very same use almost word for word with SCP 049-J. What is he a pimp now? A little added information here and there or some adjustments is one things but this is a complete transformation. He's nothing like the original at all. This falls into the same series 4 trap we are in now. This re-write is the typical series 4 format: Unneeded details, unneeded backstory, not a threat, no redactions, no mystery, and over all just plain awful. Dont fix what isnt broken. there was absolutely no reason to re-write a popular SCP article that people already like. You have make 049 far too human and understandable. Nothing in this article makes sense besides the description. The interview logs are cringey and revealing and the voice logs ever worse.
I staffposted and told Kaktus to knock it off.
Also posted this today, in response to someone stating on 049, "Might as well have just removed the -J from 049-J. -1":
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-203252/scp-049#post-3797550
Ah, whine more. These are nothing alike. If you can't tell the difference between the two, that's a failing of yours, not of the article.
Edit: You created an account just to come and whine about this article? Goodness me don't I feel special.
A conversation stop was called when the user who made the initial comment lashed out in response. Another user responded to the closed staff post noting that djkaktus was not addressed for his unnecessarily vehement comment.
Recently responded to a mainsite comment here with a staff post (shouldn't junior staff be making JS posts only, since they're not full staff) that seemed excessively strong: http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-5964895/scp-3406#post-3804511
Addressing the author when critiquing a work is unacceptable and is in violation of established criticism policy. Critique only the work being submitted - your expectations of the author don't have anything to do with it.
I've got work IRL to get to, but this and the later follow-up seem pretty unwarranted:
Again, this is an unacceptable thing to say in critiquing an article. The expectations you have for an author have nothing to do with the content of the article you're critiquing.
Do not make this kind of comment again.
What do we think? I personally feel like I disagree with this portrayal of the criticism policy (why shouldn't we expect good things from authors?) but it could just be me noticing things in a hurry.
If the post wasn’t approved by a captain than it should have been, and the last line is maybe too strong. Otherwise, I don’t think it’s an issue. Moen’s post was super contentless and did go against a couple of crit policy points. If it had any kind of substance then it wouldn’t be an issue. Maybe this would be better resolved by PMing him on IRC rather than 05ing it.
I'm glad Zyn made a post to clarify, because I see this as a pretty clear misapplication of the crit policy anyway, and I'm concerned that seeing it in a staffpost will mislead people. From rule 1:
You can criticize all of a writer's works.
Moenenby's post does acknowledge Scantron as the author, but remains focused on the article, rather than Scantron as a person - Moe said they think this compares unfavorably with the rest of Scantron's work, which is kind of shitty and unhelpful as the entirety of a crit but is explicitly not a violation of the rules.
Moen clarified it in his second post, which one can debate whether it’s contentless or not, but the first post is unambiguously “[One word apathy], [talking about other works from author in small amount of words].” That’s not critique. I’d have done the same thing
I'm definitely not saying it's good critique, or something I'd like to see more of, and while it's not quite over the line for me personally I can see calling it out for being contentless and a bit rude. (ETA - Moen's original post, not kaktus' response to it)
I just think "addressing the author when critiquing a work is unacceptable" is a misleading statement, especially delivered in such a forceful context. (So I'm glad a clarification on that specific point is visible in the thread, otherwise new members seeing it might think they aren't allowed to say things like "I love the characters you come up with" or "your articles all have had good ideas, but needed more proofreading.")
Sure. And that can be done in a PM over IRC rather than put up on 05.
Given that the last post regarding this user was never noted to have been addressed or resolved by the team captain, I felt that in the interest of keeping everyone else in the loop, I would make an O5 post.
Furthermore, I believe it's been stated a fair number of times by community members that djkaktus seems to have received special/preferential treatment with regards to staff response to behavior, and I would like to have those concerns addressed.
At any rate, the question about JS making Staff Posts still stands.
Furthermore, I believe it's been stated a fair number of times by community members that djkaktus seems to have received special/preferential treatment with regards to staff response to behavior, and I would like to have those concerns addressed.
On-site? Because a number of complaints I've been seeing about it come from people mad about 049 or 4channers or whatever. And even if this were the case, I don't think the posts we're talking about here is what should address that topic.
I concur with decibelles on mostl accounts - the only issue I see is the possibility of it not having been approved by the Captain.
I'm gonna throw in my 2 cents.
I don't believe the staff post was warranted for this comment. The post wasn't trying to be critique but was a very quick summary of a users opinion. They made it very clear they were underwhelmed and personally expected more from Scantron.
I don't feel this is an attack on Scantron, I feel Moen had expectations that for them weren't met.
Me saying "Meh. Underwhelmed. I expected more from Steve Spielberg" in regards to Ready Player One doesn't mean I'm attacking him, it's just a quick summary of my opinion.
As Kaktus is JS, this also should have been clearly marked as a Junior Staff post and should've been checked with kaktus' team captain.
tl;dr I feel the staff warning was unnecessary as the user wasn't attacking the author and had what I see as a valid opinion and either way this should've been made clear it's a JS staff post and should've been checked with kaktus' captain.
Edit: You would also be hard pressed to find any critic that at some point hasn't said they were disappointed by a writer/director/actor or were surprised by a writer/director/actor. It's a valid criticism.
Me saying "Meh. Underwhelmed. I expected more from Steve Spielberg" in regards to Ready Player One doesn't mean I'm attacking him, it's just a quick summary of my opinion.
You're not reviewing a movie on an amateur movie rating/review site, you're leaving feedback on someone's writing for a creative writing website. "Meh" and "Underwhelmed" say nothing about the article. In fact, the second rule of the criticism policy states:
Your posts must contain some kind of content: "Meh" on its own does not count as content, because it does not help the author improve their work and is no more informative than a downvote.
Now, one can say that "Underwhelmed" is valid as part of the criticism policy as per the second guideline, "I didn't care for it" or "I dislike this idea" are both allowed. Moen's not saying "This article felt underwhelming", or "The story/aspects/characters/etc. underwhelmed me". One word sentences shouldn't count as content. "I expected more from Scantron" doesn't tell Scantron how to improve the article; just that it didn't meet Moen's personal and self-imposed expectations from them. So the only thing about the post that one can give Moen is that "Underwhelmed." is technically part of the criticism policy, but just barely. Moen did elaborate on the point in the second post, which Kaktus probably shouldn't have staff-posted really. But that also goes back to my point that kaktus could have just been PM'd instead of 05'ing. Something like his vehement attacks on others in the 049 discussion thread, even as a reaction to channers or whatever, warrants logging as staff should be held to a higher standard than that. But this is really nothing in comparison.
Edit: You would also be hard pressed to find any critic that at some point hasn't said they were disappointed by a writer/director/actor or were surprised by a writer/director/actor. It's a valid criticism.
This isn't imDB, or RateYourMusic, or GameFAQs. We have higher standards than casual remarks on being disappointed in a movie celebrity for not performing as well as we expect them to.
I was going to write a long follow up but I don't feel this is the place to do it and we have extremely different opinions regarding feedback on articles.
I'm going to go back to the subject on hand which is that kaktus' post was suggesting Moen made a personal attack on Scantron which just is not the case as far as I can see so I don't think a staff post (at least for personally attacking Scantron) was warranted. Maybe a post asking them to expand on their feedback would've been sufficient. I don't personally feel they needed to expand but this would've been the better way to handle this.
I don't really have an opinion on whether this should've been done by PM or O5 (both seem like valid options to me), only on the staff post itself which I feel was unnecessary.
You're not reviewing a movie on an amateur movie rating/review site, you're leaving feedback on someone's writing for a creative writing website. "Meh" and "Underwhelmed" say nothing about the article.
We get a fair number of responses that are similarly brief but don't get called out. There's a lot of stuff like "I like it! +1", "I didn't like it -1", "Neat", "Very badly written", and so on that gets posted every day. It seems like there's an inconsistency in how strict the enforcement is, given this case.
Something like his vehement attacks on others in the 049 discussion thread, even as a reaction to channers or whatever, warrants logging as staff should be held to a higher standard than that.
Did anyone ever speak to djkaktus about the 049 stuff, as well as the lack of reviews on mainsite articles posted even though he's JS for Site Crit? (Is he JS for any other teams? It doesn't quite sit right with me here that lately the only Site Crit-related activity seen from him in the past few weeks is this case.)
But this is really nothing in comparison.
I had mainly intended this to be a quick "this isn't something we want to see JS doing, the captain will address it, case closed" discussion, but given the response, we may need to have another discussion about the criticism policy and how staff are expected to enforce it.
as well as the lack of reviews on mainsite articles posted even though he's JS for Site Crit?
Is this relevant to this issue? My captain hasn't brought this up as an issue. This (and what follows immediately afterwards) feels less like discussion of a non-disciplinary issue and more an indictment of my worth as a staff member.
Mayhaps I'm speaking out of turn here, but Soulless did address the earlier issue with me, and I admitted then that I had responded poorly to what I felt was unfair criticism and would resolve to do better in the future. I can only imagine that point wasn't communicated due to how busy Soulless has been with the last week of school.
In this case, I responded that way because I've heard that same criticism before, and it sucks. Hearing what amounts to "I expected better from you" sucks, and it isn't useful crit, and nobody deserves that, least of all Scantron. As for the lack of a "junior" before the "staff post", I honestly just forgot. My mistake, won't happen again.
And additional concerns can be addressed to me directly, I suppose, although Soulless is the only person to have done that so far. And I appreciated it! Can't say enough about how great a team captain they've been.
Is this relevant to this issue?
I felt it was, as context for my concern over the lack of noted follow-up regarding the previous case. In the future, I think it's fine for someone with O5 access1 to note that they've been contacted regarding their behavior and the matter is resolved. That way, it doesn't look like the issue was just ignored and left to be gradually forgotten.
but Soulless did address the earlier issue with me, and I admitted then that I had responded poorly to what I felt was unfair criticism and would resolve to do better in the future.
As for the lack of a "junior" before the "staff post", I honestly just forgot. My mistake, won't happen again.
This is all I (and I think others with my concerns) needed to see.
I didn't want to overstep my bounds with regards to how soulless wanted to resolve our discussion. In other words, I didn't think it was my place to comment first. I wouldn't have, if I hadn't seen a question brewing about my intrinsic value around here.
Plus, that discussion very well could've taken place in staff chat, and I would've had no way to know.
Dropping these in the Non-disc thread:
Kaktus has been involved with a ton of arguments lately, several of which have lead to stop orders:
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-1218274/scp-7143-j
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-6274592/4000contestcwwktkb
I'm not sure if picking fights is necessarily breaking rule 1, but two stop orders in a week is a lot.
Noting for records-keeping that another conversation stop order was dropped in a discussion thread earlier this month after these comments:
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-7442453/scp-4911#post-3967881
it’s a very tasteless one.
Sort of shitty to make a comment like this without elaborating as to why you think that.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-7442453/scp-4911#post-3988624
And ofc it's Kaktus.
Better than the alternative. I could be spending my time calling authors lazy in discussion threads.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-7442453/scp-4911#post-3989357
Can't fix stupid.
http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-7442453/scp-4911#post-3990935
So what's allowing them to take shots at me in the first place, if the inverse warrants a staff post? Should people who say stupid things in comment threads that will be there forever not be held accountable for those things? Because staff doesn't seem interested in doing so.
djkaktus responded to the most recent 2721 bait comment with a personal attack unrelated to the article at hand.
Original comment:
This doesn't feel like an SCP article.
It feels more like a blog promotion :/
There's no mystery, it's just blogs crammed in next to a "spooky satellite"
Kaktus' response:
Imagine sitting on an account for years just to make a comment this asanine.
Worth noting that this is the comment's 3rd reply, and follows a more civil one from an admin addressing the commenter's lack of site activity and suggesting they read other articles instead.
Comments: You can comment anywhere on the site, as long as you are respectful to other users. All comments must follow the Criticism Policy. Do not troll or make personal attacks.
(Critique the work, not the author. Do not make personal attacks on the author. Stick to criticizing their work.)
(Don't dog-pile. If an article already has several significant posts about its flaws, you don't need to jump in and say you also think it's terrible. Post if you have something new to say.)
Posting per instruction from Soulless.
I recieved several accusations against djkaktus today in Site17. Below are my findings in this matter:
Initially posted Dec 20th, 2017, an then Feb 4th 2018, but taken down both times due to downvotes, and then reuploaded recently, my article (under the new title Monachopsis) has come under fire for allegedly plagarizing DJKaktus. Sandboxes for Apotheosis are deleted, and the earliest mention of it seems to be on Jun 4th, but we can guess it started about April 20th, the release of the doomsday contest. This also includes a tale, all within 1 1/2 months.
In conclusion, both articles contain a 2-bit researcher turned impossibly powerful reality bender, via a device created by the Foundation itself, used to create a singularity never before seen, that they were providing maintenance on as part of a larger research team, which must be contained using a device similar but not the same as the one that created them, because the device was powered up while containing faulty engineering issues. Then the SCP focuses on the world ending catastrophe that happens if they're let out.
Additionally, the title of the SCP at the time of my posting was Aletheosis, a combination of Metamorphosis and the Latin or Greek or whatever alethiesm. I believe the title Apotheoisis may *potentially derive* from mine as well but I am perhaps uneducated on its use in the greater SCP community.
Additionally, after attempting to talk to Kaktus about it, instead of calmly working it over he very aggressively denied any connection and called me spiteful and jealous, then downvoted my SCP immediately afterwards would suggest to me foul play.
What say you?
I investigated this claim of plagiarism regarding apotheosis, and found the following salient points
I investigated the claim of plagiarism regarding the darkbody doomcon entry and
Additional PMs recieved from the user:
So the dates thing as described by djkaktus is innacurate; as the early sandbox provided that stems in 2017 is only related in the context that its a reality bender, with no relation otherwise. Additionally, if he did reuse his idea, this would be violating the contest rules that he submitted the piece on because it was supposed to be an original work. there is not a surviving sandbox for anything on the topic of apotheosis as the linked sandbox which if I recall correctly is djkaktusxiii does not contain any revisions for apotheosis, only a non-specific reality bender unrelated to both apotheosis and aletheosis. Upon December 2017, the sandbox is repurposed for his Void SCP, which has 0 relation.
http://kontainer.djkakt.us/kaktuskontainerxiii link specified
My drafts on the topic, in order.
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/what-it-means-to-be-humeman
http://scpsandbox2.wikidot.com/what-it-means-to-be-humeman-6
http://scp-sandbox-3.wikidot.com/aletheosis
http://scp-sandbox-3.wikidot.com/morphosis
At the link specified, http://kontainer.djkakt.us/kaktuskontainerxiii, Kaktus says he has been working over the idea for Apotheosis since September. Going there reveals a draft I assumed had never been written but turns out to be http://www.scp-wiki.net/scp-3812, which is unrelated to my claims. The article I have claimed as my intellectual property is http://www.scp-wiki.net/djkaktus-s-proposal-ii, to make sure everything is clarified.
This is all that's relevant to this portion of the user's grievance.
So I’m looking at this and the main complaint is that these articles are really similar in concept. I’m not entirely willing to buy that this was plagiarism, mostly because the allegations seem more on a conceptual level. (Also, I cant make sense of the image evidence post at all.) That being said, going on to instantly downvote someone else’s work after they were shitty was a shitty move in Kaktus’ behalf.
But really, I don’t understand this allegation from this user. In this case the user is claiming that Kaktus is responsible for an article he didn’t write? Or is there something else going on?
Living the dream, or dreaming the life?
I think this user is probably confusing "Apotheosis" with "Ouroboros". The former does not even remotely match the points of similarity brought up in the complaint (main characters are not researchers, transformation of characters is not caused by Foundation technology, etc) while the third chapter of Ouroboros does follow the outline described.
To be clear, I don't think the complaint is valid, as it's painfully obvious to me how two people could have come up with this same idea separately or simply had similar inspirations. However I think the complainant mixing up titles may be where the confusion is coming from.
Yeh, agreeing with Magnus' suppositions here. There's nothing Kaktus has done wrong from what I can see.
Admin, SCP Wiki
Made this post with MayD's permission.
kaktus posted this: http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-12313199/dado-big-brain-pill#post-4330425
which cant really be called crit but just comes off as unnecessary sass, that does not help the user.
N_Aepic_Fael does not match any existing user name staff posted with taylor_itkin does not match any existing user name's permission.
Edit: kaktus came into site17 to explain himself.
naepicfael> Victor Staffposted on the dado post. Does anyone mind checking to see if I came off as vehement here?
15:41:49 http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-12313199/dado-big-brain-pill#post-4330459
15:42:10 <•edna> You're fine.
15:42:28 <naepicfael> Victor works for me
15:44:37 <•Crashington> posted on o5
15:45:32
<djkaktus> Benjam Hang on now.
15:46:01 That's just a joke. It's been well established that everytime somebody capitalizes "dado" I ask them "what's a Dado?"
15:46:06 This is not something new
15:46:37 Like
15:46:38 <•edna> It's not new, but it's not cool to do that on a I&B thread.
15:46:45
<djkaktus> Benjam It's not
15:47:01
<•Mayd> Mayday This is a crit thread, and you've been told off before by staff for doing this, Kaktus.
15:47:07
<djkaktus> Benjam It's just a joke, on a thread that was already getting attention
15:47:11 It was well meaning
15:47:15 Come on guys, honestly.
15:47:29 If anything it bumped the thread for that guy
15:47:41 <•edna> That's not an excuse.
15:47:55
<djkaktus> Benjam Mayd: I've been told off for being snarky, this is literally just me poking fun at the capitalization
15:47:59 There's no snark here
15:48:01 <naepicfael> Victor Kaktus, I know I placeholdered, but I'm not the only critter around. You have a reputation as one of the best writer's around. People would, if anything, be less inclined to review, thinking you address all the issues
15:48:59 → AndroUser2 joined (~androirc@7B5D93A5:E747BCB5:1028BECC:IP)
15:49:12
<Mew-ltiverse> Mewlti-Verse Hate to interrupt but question when I give crit as part of my junior staff site crit job do I title the thread to show that or not?
15:49:19
<djkaktus> Benjam I can't believe this. This one actually flummoxes me. It's just a bit of fun. I saw this guy was doing a dado thing, saw the capitalization, and just popped in to make a little joke. Engage with the constituency
15:49:24
<•Mayd> Mayday Up to you, Mew-ltiverse.
15:49:36
<Mew-ltiverse> Mewlti-Verse Alrighty
15:49:47
<djkaktus> Benjam CorvusCaurinus: you think I was out of line here?
15:49:49 Honestly.
15:50:10 → sigkreiger joined (~PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc#PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc)
15:50:16 <•edna> djkaktus: Pointless comments on any review thread get staff posted, you're not an exception.
15:50:51
<•CorvusCaurinus> Procy While I think perhaps it could have done with an explanation, or at least a "Who's Dado? It's dado," something along those lines, I recognize the intent and think it's largely harmless
15:51:01 However I am also fucking sick to my gills
15:51:03
<djkaktus> Benjam I mean, the argument can be made that it wasn't pointless and was drawing a legitimate point that dado isn't capitalized, and that comment was helpful
15:51:16 AndroUser2 → TheRealKyza
15:51:18
<djkaktus> Benjam CorvusCaurinus: damn that would've been a better way to phrase it.
15:51:48
<•CorvusCaurinus> Procy I do think that your explanation should at the very least be posted on 05 as an ameliorating factor
15:52:43
<djkaktus> Benjam I mean I could sit here and grumble all day about the quick trigger finger on the ole O5 post there but that would he satisfactory, I think.
15:53:15 I mean let's be real, my dudes. If I wanted to fuck with people I would just do it. But I don't, I just wanted to have some fun with this guy.
15:53:57
<•CorvusCaurinus> Procy Can someone do that for me? I'm fighting back vomit.
15:54:13
<djkaktus> Benjam CorvusCaurinus: you gotta get that cold cloth on the head.
15:54:18 Nature's perfect cure.
15:54:34
<•CorvusCaurinus> Procy Hah, I wish, I have this fucking medical mystery GI thing
15:54:59 ⇐ sigkreiger quit (~PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc#PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc) Quit: CGI:IRC
15:55:09
<djkaktus> Benjam And let's do please get that up ASAP lads, I don't want people thinking I'm being as shitty to newbros as that post seems to want to imply for any longer than is necessary.
15:55:15 → sigkreiger joined (~PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc#PI.51FAEEB.913DC509.8C29150B|criigc)
15:55:16
<djkaktus> Benjam CorvusCaurinus: have you tried like
15:55:17 Hmm
15:55:46 <•Crashington> will do
Kaktus responded to an inciteful comment on one of his 001 proposals with the following: http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-9044427/djkaktus-s-proposal-iii#post-4400145
Weird that nobody from staff has shown up to ring you up for this useless comment.
Regardless, you've gotta know that I don't care about this, right? This article is currently +534, which means at least that many people didn't mind it enough to downvote it. I mean, you've gotta have at least that much self awareness, right?
Magnus called a stop, as he's apparently warned kaktus about this kind of behavior before.
