First Sergeant

First Sergeant

DrEverettMann 01 Mar 2021 05:05

I've recently been told that some staff members have been hesitant to bring up issues with the admins due to the difference in power on the wiki. While we are committed to treating staff fairly and well, there is a power differential. I can't blame people for being a little hesitant. At the same time, people need to be able to tell us if they think there are problems we might not be handling well.

In the military, we have a position that acts as a liaison between the enlisted force and the commander. This person makes sure that the troops are well cared for and helps them bring concerns up to the commander that an E-1 might be too nervous to talk about. We call this person the First Sergeant, and I think we could use that same model here. We probably don't need to keep the name, but the basic idea seems like it should work for us.

I would like to nominate at least two people to act as these liaisons. If a staff member wants to let admins know about any concerns, they can bring them up to one of these individuals and have their concerns brought directly to us, the admins. Anonymously or not as the person asks, without fear of reprisal or judgement.

Thoughts on this proposal? Any issues with it, or possible refinements?

Additionally, I think Procyon would be a good choice for this role. He has always been willing to speak his mind to admins, and I have absolute confidence that he will bring any concerns left with him to us. I would also like staff, especially junior staff, to nominate candidates they would feel comfortable coming to, and who would not be intimidated by admins.

Re: First Sergeant

The_Spider_Queen 01 Mar 2021 05:36

I really like this idea. I feel like it would be beneficial for all parties involved. Everything could fall into place. Full support. I can see how people would be against this, as nobody should be too anxious to talk to one another (on a personal level). I believe we need a longer term solution, it might work for now, but I think what needs to happen for the future is more team building type "exercises". We need to be closer and have less animosity/distrust to each other especially between Junior Staff and Senior Staff. There's too big a gap between staff and junior staff, and I can see this problem only becoming more prominent. Staff as a whole need to have more of a trust with each other, but I'm just not seeing it happening right now or with this solution.

Assuming we're still planning on going through with this, I believe Procyon is an interesting choice, but his boldness may actually suit this sort of position well. My main concern is the conversations between staff and himself, mixed with his attitude, and (as I said before) boldness. I can see this turning both ways for good and for bad. I really like Procyon, and I think he could be a good fit for this, but my concerns are still lingering.

Taylor, Lady Katie, or Yossipossi would be a good fit for the job as well. Lady Katie has been doing this sort of thing for a long long time, she would absolutely be an asset to the position and would fill the role well. Taylor, I feel would be good, because of his status as co-captain of Community Outreach, as well as his ability to talk to people in a welcoming/"I'm going to make sure this is heard" type way. Yossi is a great person but I haven't interacted with him much, which means I have no clue the level of spunk he has when talking to those above him. Though, his status as MAST Vice Captain would fit well as MAST being the largest staff team, would help as having access to a larger audience of staff. I feel all of them would be good fits, however I am leaning more towards Katie due to her previous experience with this type of work, as well as her position as an ambassador for the -EN branch itself.

Last edited on 01 Mar 2021 20:05 by The_Spider_Queen Show more

Re: First Sergeant

DrEverettMann 01 Mar 2021 05:56

Procy's brusque manner actually was brought up when I first broached the idea with site leadership. That's one of the reasons why we're looking for more than one person to fill the role.

Re: First Sergeant

The_Spider_Queen 01 Mar 2021 06:01

That comforts me, I'm not claiming he's not deserving of the job, I think part of the reason he would be good for the job is his curtness. Either way, I do believe he should get the job.

Last edited on 01 Mar 2021 06:04 by The_Spider_Queen Show more

Re: First Sergeant

OptimisticLucio 01 Mar 2021 11:10

I'm not entirely sold on the idea.

I feel like making this position will only make manners worse, as it'll strengthen said divide that makes people hesitant to talk by explicitly separating the two groups (to the point where we need someone to act as a "bridge" between them).

I'd offer an alternative, or some improvement to the idea, but I'm not entirely sure what would be a better solution due to me only leaving JS a few weeks ago. Passing the proposal among other staff before presenting it publically would likely help, in terms of giving the presenter more confidence in their idea, but I imagine that's not why people feel intimidated by the admins.

Re: First Sergeant

Naepic 01 Mar 2021 14:47

This doesn't strengthen the divide so much as acknowledges it exists. While I don't think anyone here would disagree that the divide existing kinda sucks, appointing a liason that is known for being forward to act as a starting bridge helps ensure we have a temporary measure to close the distance before attempting other means to stem the gap.

Re: First Sergeant

gee0765 01 Mar 2021 18:35

I don't think this comes close to working as a solution. We shouldn't have people on the staff team feel too anxious to talk to others, and having someone in the middle might allow their voices to be heard more but doesn't stop this being a problem.

What this does do, however, is act as a bandage while we try to fix the problem. People with solutions who were previously worried to speak up might feel better suggesting them.

Tentatively supporting, exclusively as a temporary measure while we work out how to make the divide less intimidating.

Re: First Sergeant

OCuin 01 Mar 2021 19:52

These are essentially my thoughts.

Re: First Sergeant

Kufat 01 Mar 2021 19:22

To clarify, is the issue that admins are behaving in an offputting manner or is it that JS members are intimidated by the prospect of approaching an admin because they're an admin?

Re: First Sergeant

Naepic 01 Mar 2021 19:47

The latter, though this is meant to encompass members of all staff levels below administrator.

Re: First Sergeant

Kufat 02 Mar 2021 01:06

I think that this is a problem for individual staffers to solve for themselves rather than something that needs to be dealt with on an official basis, whether by introducing a new position or otherwise.

The thing is, admins aren't officers. Military officers have a tremendous degree of power over their subordinates' lives. Admins aren't teachers, with the power to assign grades, nor are they managers, with the ability to determine who gets a raise and who gets fired. This is a hobby project. The situation here is closer to talking with the head of one's book club or the GM of a tabletop RPG than it is to talking with one's commanding officer.

I get the anxiety. I've dealt with social anxiety my whole life, and I probably always will. (All kidding aside, I'm nervous about writing this comment.) It seems to me that this would help slightly, but that it'd mostly just move the target of staffers' anxiety from admins to this new role. It'd make more work for staff on top of that.

The intentions behind this are in line with the spirit of helpfulness and supportiveness that makes this such a pleasant community to be a part of, but I don't think this proposal would result in a net benefit if implemented.

Re: First Sergeant

(account deleted) 02 Mar 2021 02:11

This basically says what I would.

Re: First Sergeant

Naveil 01 Mar 2021 19:35

Seconding a lot of what was said. While this isn't a bad idea, it's essentially throwing all the clothes under the bed and hoping the parents don't notice. It works, perhaps for the foreseeable future, but it ignores the issue at its core.¹ A priority of ours should be to stamp out the issue where it stands, but this works as an interim solution.

If I could offer two cents on the main issue - admittedly, I have a lot of trouble speaking up to superiors, for issues entirely unrelating to their characters and more so due to my own personal anxieties. It's a natural fear that comes with speaking to someone in a higher position than yourself, be it a teacher, manager, boss, etc. More than anything else, it's a fear perpetuated from unfamiliarity. Being unfamiliar with a superior makes it far more difficult to talk to them on the "casual" scale. On the flip-side, knowing them well makes it far easier to request things, to let them know something, even just to crack a joke to ease tension.

Whatever a potential permanent solution for this issue should be, it should strive to bring all staff groups closer together, rather than throwing in a middleman and discouraging any chances for communication.

Footnotes

1. Not to imply that it avoids the issue

Re: First Sergeant

MrAnakinSpecter 01 Mar 2021 20:27

I would tentatively support this as a solution, but only in an "in the event we can find no other good answers to the problem after long discussion" sort of way. Additionally, perhaps the nominated person should not be a member of senior staff to avoid the same issues that apparently spawned their position in the first place.

Re: First Sergeant

Truc Linh 01 Mar 2021 20:47

As someone who has overwhelming social anxiety to the point where I can’t stay in IRC Chat for more than 10 minutes without getting extremely anxious and stressed, I do not think this is the best solution. I personally think the root of the problem is the lack of familiarity (on a more personal level) with individual staff members in general. For example, when I started as a Flight Officer last spring, I felt slightly intimidated by my Commander (sorry, Commander). However, after finishing the Flight and being able to get to know him better in an environment, where there is a small number of other people, helped me to better manage my anxiety. Eventually, I no longer felt intimidated by him and started to feel more comfortable talking to him about things. After that, I felt comfortable enough to step out of my comfort zone and start interacting with others through the Flight Program. Getting back to the subject at hand, in all honestly, the only staff members I’ve interacted with the most so far are Zyn and RockTeethMothEyes. If any other staff member besides those two (and a few others from the Forum Crit Team), were to take a position as a bridge to the admins, I honestly would feel no different towards them—I’d still be too shy.

Is it possible we could come up with a solution similar to the Butterfly Flights where both members and staff could have the opportunity to get together into small groups of 2-3 to help the other teams out? Like, give everyone the opportunity to get to know more staff members besides the Forum Crit Team and to help out other teams so that members can get to walk in the shoes of staff? I think that would build a better bridge and understanding between everyone, and it could be a great way for present and future Junior Staff to build solid relationships with Senior Staff. I know I just came up with this on the spot, and this is most likely to be turned down because this idea may have a plethora of flaws, but I think it might be something worth considering.

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This Life Is Mine

Re: First Sergeant

Yossipossi 01 Mar 2021 21:56

I believe that this could be implemented to address an issue that practically every JS brings up since I joined staff: the separation between the community and the staff team. While the gap between staff at large and administrators have significantly shrunk over the past few months, the gap between staff and the userbase has not significantly changed, bar some extraordinary circumstances. I believe this proposal would help alleviate some of that gap if it was implemented with a wider scope. The two individuals selected could serve as a minor subteam of either CO, IO, or Ambassador (two/one person subteams are already a thing), and would forward messages from the userbase directly to the admins. I am in full support of this type of proposal; the current proposal I am hesitantly supporting.

As for who should be the liaisons, I do not have any specific recommendations.

EDIT: I believe this should only be a temporary policy. I am currently working on other, more permanent policies to address this issue with other people.

Last edited on 02 Mar 2021 23:25 by Yossipossi Show more

Re: First Sergeant

WhiteGuard 02 Mar 2021 00:26

I am a big fan of this idea. I am always a fan of trying to bridge the gap between staff and the community and it is something that I actively try to do when possible. This addition to the original proposal seems like the way to go to help staff inner communication as well as community and staff communication. As a note, this role would probably belong within the Ambassador team.

Last edited on 02 Mar 2021 00:27 by WhiteGuard Show more

Re: First Sergeant

OptimisticLucio 02 Mar 2021 18:43

I am in favor of anything that bridges the endless valley between staff and the community.

Re: First Sergeant

The_Spider_Queen 02 Mar 2021 19:03

I think this is a good solution when talking about staff and community members. However, I don't think it's the only thing we need to be doing to patch the gap, (assuming we're still talking about the wider scope). I find myself feeling this would be better as either Ambassador or Community Outreach, leaning Community Outreach as it is quite literally the title of that team.

Re: First Sergeant

TheMightyMcB 02 Mar 2021 09:57

Tossing my $0.02 in the ring for this one. For me personally, it's often less the rank of Administrator that discourages any direct confrontation or disagreement so much as it's usually either a lack of the energy required to express an opinion that I know will be unpopular amongst the most experienced members of staff, or that I simply wasn't around to express a strong opinion of mine when the discussion was actually ongoing. I have no actual qualms about telling anyone what I think as far as being expected to defend my opinions, but doing so is rarely a quick and easy process. Even at the best of times, it can be a fairly emotionally draining endeavor.. As a result, I usually pop into the DMs of a staffer I trust (and which staffer I choose is a decision that is usually catered to the matter at hand as well) to say my piece or gather additional context. The usual suspects for me are Bleep, Malyce, taylor, and Procy, but I imagine that every staffer would give a completely different list of people that they're comfortable approaching, and that's a big problem that I see with this proposal. I might be comfortable talking to those people, but I can totally understand why a staffer who doesn't know them as well may not be as comfortable speaking candidly with them as I am. I don't think there will be any answers for these "First Sergeant" roles that everyone would agree or be comfortable with. Already in this thread, I've seen suggestions for multiple people I wouldn't choose to go to, no offense to those individuals.

As such, I'm finding myself agreeing with Gee here in that this really doesn't fix the issue of a disconnect between admins and the rest of staff. All I know is the system that I have personally developed for dealing with that disconnect as described above, and that's not a method that works well for folks who have few, if any, upper-level staff that they trust on an interpersonal level.

If prodded for a vague solution, I might suggest that we attempt to link up new staffers with experienced staffers in order to better establish that rapport that leads to the natural development of a healthy support system, similar to the effect that forum crit flights seem to be having.

Last edited on 02 Mar 2021 10:36 by TheMightyMcB Show more

Re: First Sergeant

cybersqyd 02 Mar 2021 13:32

I have very mixed feelings on this proposal as a whole that I'm still untangling but the suggestion at the end here:

I might suggest that we attempt to link up new staffers with experienced staffers in order to better establish that rapport that leads to the natural development of a healthy support system, similar to the effect that forum crit flights seem to be having.

Seems like a better solution to me. I would possibly push for admin level staff to take a more active involvement in what JS get up to but obviously they're dang busy and this would be yet another pile of work for 'em.

Re: First Sergeant

Truc Linh 02 Mar 2021 14:47

It doesn’t have to be our current admins. If we can have a bit more involvement from other senior staff, I think it should be enough. Obviously, admins retire and mods get promoted to adminship, so it may not instantly resolve the issue now, but it may progress over time as lower rank staff move up in promotions.

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This Life Is Mine

Re: First Sergeant

The_Spider_Queen 02 Mar 2021 18:58

I would possibly push for admin level staff to take a more active involvement in what JS get up to but obviously they're dang busy and this would be yet another pile of work for 'em.

I don't think it's entirely an issue with just admins though. I feel Mods and (older) OS also need to have their eyes on what JS are up to. I do find myself agreeing with McB's and Cybersqyd's statements and I do thing this would be a better solution in the long run.

Re: First Sergeant

DrBleep 06 Mar 2021 00:37

Just a note that I make it a point to personally interact with all of the JS under my banner.