New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Summary:

It's been a long time coming.

New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Zyn 02 Mar 2020 03:06

Announcement thread to keep everyone in the loop.

So… after a fair bit of discussion with reviewers, and thanks to TheMightyMcB for spearheading the process, a new set of forum requirements has been implemented for the Ideas Critique forum: http://www.scp-wiki.net/forum/t-13095662/required-reading:how-to-use-this-forum-ideas

Basically, we are:

• requiring a template for concept critique requests, to make authors more aware of the nuances of quality writing on the site, and make it less of a strain for reviewers to dig through a post for the basics
• cutting the maximum summary wordcount from 500 words to 400.
• restricting users to a limit of posting 2 new concept critique threads per week (7 day timeframe)

Staff, the new reference copypasta are being added here: http://05command.wikidot.com/forum-crit-reference

For convenience when checking wordcount, the titles of the ending portions of the template are 10 words total. (Take the wordcount of the text of those sections, subtract 10). We can be lenient if something is 405 words or the like, but more than 15 words or so over is pushing it.

Will continue to update as the change is implemented. Given the recent flooding of the forums and frustration and burnout from reviewers, this is long overdue.

We will also be implementing an auto-defer process for the Ideas Critique forum, similar to the drafts forum to hopefully indicate to authors what the basic threshold of quality concept writing is, as well as direct reviewer attention to concepts that are more likely to survive the mainsite. Stay tuned for more updates.

Last edited on 02 Mar 2020 04:50 by Zyn Show more

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Shanor 02 Mar 2020 04:22

Well, I feel like this should help alleviate several issues within the ideas forum. But I do feel as if there are some issues with these new policies.

+ Show Block

First, I feel like the genre category, while helpful in being able to understand a concept, could also cause problems depending on how people see the policies. I could see having to put down genre causing some people to think they can only stick to that genre for the idea. I mean, we already get people who have difficulties understanding that you can change the genre of your idea. And while they are a fairly small minority (and will likely stay that way even after these policies start working), the fact is they are some of the most difficult people to deal with as a reviewer (at least IMO), so any increase feels troublesome. I can also see this issue of people over-focusing on specific aspects of an article with page type and hook as well, but to a far lesser extent. Overall it just feels a little unnecessary to me to force something like genre in.

Secondly, as I said previously in a thread talking about a similar policy in the drafting forums, I feel like this is only going to make work harder for us. Even with our currently much lower standards, we end up having to staff post quite a few threads in a day. Honestly I feel like using this new system will only exasterbate this issue. And are we only going to staffpost on them, or are staff going to lock every thread that doesn't comply? Either way it seems to be putting extra work on our already-overworked team.

Thirdly, I feel like the extra complication (and I understand it is very basic. It just doesn't seem like it would look that way to a new user) will only cause more coldposts. I mean, we already stopped draft threads from being made so that we could put more focus on the ideas forum. I feel like making the ideas process have all this extra regulation is only going to cause more people to coldpost or PM butterfly squad members. I guess we will just have to wait and see to know whether this will actually happen, but I feel like it is a major possibility.

And finally, I feel like this is unnecessary. I realize it's frustrating to have to go through all these forum posts, but I have seen the speed at which new posts are made; honestly, It doesn't seem to be at a rate that is worse than previously. Not to mention the fact that users are currently in an upswing in quality right now.

It is true that I haven't really been able to do as much as previously due to IRL commitments, so I might not understand the forum as well as I did previously; however when it comes to the I&B forum at least, I feel fairly confident in my understanding of it. This currently feels like it could end up causing quite a few more headaches for staff. Though I guess we can see.

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Zyn 02 Mar 2020 04:45

I could see having to put down genre causing some people to think they can only stick to that genre for the idea

If reviewers tell someone that their premise would be more workable if a different approach is used, it's not difficult for the author to change that section. If authors really want to stick to the genre because they like it, that's their prerogative.

Overall it just feels a little unnecessary to me to force something like genre in.

It helps reviewers see at a glance if they'd be interested in reviewing something when looking at multiple threads. It can also help match authors to reviewers.

we only going to staffpost on them, or are staff going to lock every thread that doesn't comply?

Only staffpost, no need to lock. There's already a copy-paste template on the References page, linked above.

I feel like the extra complication (and I understand it is very basic. It just doesn't seem like it would look that way to a new user) will only cause more coldposts.

Coldposts are actually much easier to deal with. They don't look great on the site, but they are quickly cleared, whereas forum threads linger and generate clutter.

It doesn't seem to be at a rate that is worse than previously.

I'll be honest—this is entirely untrue. If you look at the rate of new threads created every week, we're consistently topping 250 whereas in previous weeks we were under 200. Threads are falling unanswered to pages 4 and 5 on the same day they were posted.

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Shanor 02 Mar 2020 06:00

If reviewers tell someone that their premise would be more workable if a different approach is used, it's not difficult for the author to change that section. If authors really want to stick to the genre because they like it, that's their prerogative.

I still feel like misunderstanding would be more likely to occur with this, but honestly I am fine not arguing this. We will know for sure if it starts happening, and can easily change it.

It helps reviewers see at a glance if they'd be interested in reviewing something when looking at multiple threads. It can also help match authors to reviewers.

It's possible I might just have a skewed perception of this. I generally don't care about genre. But I can see how that would help users that do prefer specific genres for critiquing.

Coldposts are actually much easier to deal with. They don't look great on the site, but they are quickly cleared, whereas forum threads linger and generate clutter.

I guess I might overestimate how annoying it is to deal with coldposts.

I'll be honest—this is entirely untrue. If you look at the rate of new threads created every week, we're consistently topping 250 whereas in previous weeks we were under 200. Threads are falling unanswered to pages 4 and 5 on the same day they were posted.

Huh, it might just be that I look at the forum enough that I never really noticed the changes.

Either way though, I think we should at least monitor this to see the effectiveness it has. I could definitely be wrong, so we will see.

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

TheMightyMcB 02 Mar 2020 13:21

It should also be worth noting that a secondary purpose for the genre tags is to make it immediately clear to new writers that the SCP Wiki is more than a creepypasta horror site. All kinds of fiction work here, but this fact is not immediately obvious to all newcomers. Simply being asked what genre they would like to write could be all that is needed to even make these users consider alternatives at all.

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

RJB_R 02 Mar 2020 17:13

One minor change I’d make is to not have the template under a collapsible, it’s easy to miss especially if you’re unfamiliar with the wiki and might not be aware of it. If it crowds the post too much, maybe have it as a reply to the OP?

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

aismallard 02 Mar 2020 22:18

Agreed. Collapsibles, or even the fact that red text constitutes a clickable link is non-obvious to new users.

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Zyn 03 Mar 2020 01:09

Changed!

Re: New Ideas Critique Forum Policies

Zyn 04 Mar 2020 01:46

Quick note that per discussion with McB and Nico, I've made the "genre" and "page layout" sections noted as optional.

Also, I've swapped the locations of the "page layout" and "elevator pitch" sections, since… that's how it was meant to be set up from the beginning.

Not a moment too soon… we're getting absolutely flooded with new applications.