Fixing Site Search

Summary:

Because it’s broken

Fixing Site Search

RJB_R 20 Feb 2019 13:30

As many of you may be aware, the WikiDot search functionality is broken. It times out every time a search is done and is basically worthless in terms of functionality. The NuSCP design layout includes a working search bar using Google.

I propose we implement that working search bar, in the same spot as the current search bar, on the Wiki, 05command and any other site we run.

Upside: The search feature will work again.

Downside: Google will serve ads when searches are performed.

I think this would be a worthy trade off but I would understand why someone else could disagree with that.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Fixing Site Search

subtletea 20 Feb 2019 13:36

I would be 100 percent behind this proposal. Google ads don't bother me with an adblocker on, and being able to have a functional search bar again would be so worth it.

Re: Fixing Site Search

SoullessSingularity 20 Feb 2019 14:07

I would first like to know how it compares with people that regularly use the search bar, eg. Community outreach. I understand the last time this was brought up(the removal of the search bar) there was criticism that it was useful to certain critical staff roles. So long as the google search does not impact those tasks I don’t really care.

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Living the dream, or dreaming the life?

Last edited on 20 Feb 2019 14:08 by SoullessSingularity Show more

Re: Fixing Site Search

Modern_Erasmus 20 Feb 2019 14:59

Honestly the regular search bar usually works for me, and when it doesn't trying it again usually works.

Re: Fixing Site Search

pxdnbluesoul 20 Feb 2019 15:04

The issue we've run into trying to implement putting the google search bar in is that there's no way to do it that won't take you off of the website. We looked at various ways to throw the results in an iframe on the page and due to some security settings above our heads (at wikidot), we can't do it. A pretty pivotal concept in web design is don't take your users off your own website, but the extant search function is objectively awful and rarely works. Tough call.

Re: Fixing Site Search

RJB_R 20 Feb 2019 20:14

Maybe instead of outright replacing the search function, we could link to this secondary search option with a label letting people know that this is a functional search option which will take them off-site. Apparently search is working for some people so making it the backup without completely removing the search feature that doesn’t take you off-site

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Fixing Site Search

UraniumEmpire 21 Feb 2019 18:44

While I would say that I support this measure, adding a secondary google search feels like the web design equivalent of admitting defeat. Even if this is a general wikidot issue, it'd still be a jarring contrast for the casual explorer.

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… and I'm not Robert Frost.

Re: Fixing Site Search

RJB_R 21 Feb 2019 19:23

I mean, admitting defeat when you have been defeated might not be the worst thing in the world

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Fixing Site Search

UraniumEmpire 21 Feb 2019 19:38

True, although I admit I'm worried about the optics moreso than whether or not we've been defeated (which, given my experience searching, I'll happily say that we have).

If this is a temporary solution until we can make something better, I'm all for it, but I do share pxdnbluesoul's concerns that we're essentially taking the explorers outside and asking them to come back in.

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… and I'm not Robert Frost.

Re: Fixing Site Search

(account deleted) 21 Feb 2019 22:15

I’m not sure how I feel about this for more reason than one, but one of which is that it might simply look terrible and clutter up the area on the banner?

Re: Fixing Site Search

RJB_R 22 Feb 2019 05:32

No, I’m talking about the search results page not sharing real estate with the module.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Fixing Site Search

(account deleted) 22 Feb 2019 22:38

ah, gotcha.

Re: Fixing Site Search

(account deleted) 20 Feb 2019 20:13

Everything bluesoul says above is essentially what my thoughts on this are - however, the search bar is almost useless at its current juncture. I think having it there at this point is useless and replacing it is our best bet

edit: upon realizing this is almost entirely in tech team’s purview, has anyone bothered to see what magnus thinks about this?

Last edited on 21 Feb 2019 22:16 by (account deleted) Show more

Re: Fixing Site Search

RJB_R 22 Feb 2019 06:08

I believe he’s seen it in SSSC and had concerns analogous to the ones Bluesoul brought up.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Fixing Site Search

TSATPWTCOTTTADC 18 Mar 2019 16:19

Let's talk some more about what we'd like to see in a successful search proposal.

In a recent voting thread (link) I pointed out some shortcomings of the proposed Google search bar. Here is a copy from my post there:

• One drawback is that users lose access to the "pages only" and "forum only" search options that are available on scp-wiki.net/search:site.

• Another drawback is that a lot of the Google search results lead to the printer-friendly versions of SCP Wiki pages. This just leaves users stranded with no site navigation.

   + Image

• Yet another drawback is that for some searches there is more than a screen's height of ads with some common screen sizes.

   + Image

I thought I'd clarify - the drawbacks of this current proposal can be solved and we could present a much better search experience to our readers than the currently proposed one.

+ An example, if you're curious

For example - if you want to search just the forums for the word "test" - you can google "test site:scp-wiki.net/forum". If you want to exclude the forums - you can google "test -url:forum site:scp-wiki.net". I'd like us to consider making it possible for all readers to perform such searches, not just readers with strong knowledge of how Google Search works. The solutions to each of the drawbacks would require more investigations and decisions such as: Do these search arguments work with Google's Custom Search Engine feature (the feature used in the nuSCP example Roget linked)? And: How do we present these options to the readers - as multiple search buttons in the header of every page, or as part of the scp-wiki.net/search:site page, or some other way? And: Now that we know that we can have searches that exclude forums, is that actually a valuable enough feature to implement in this new search?

I am optimistic that we could have a search solution that lacks most of these shortcomings.
I would like to know if the Community Outreach and the Technical team want to and are able to commit some time to finding a solution to wiki search that is more reliable than Wikidot's search and is better than the Google search as proposed by Roget.
I ask CO and Tech as it seems to me that site search falls within the scope of both of these teams' work and concerns.

If there is interest then a couple of things should be decided before a vote takes place:

• Which team would take the lead on this and be ultimately responsible for the resultant solution, its implementation, and its upkeep?
  Tech, with help from CO? CO, with help from Tech?

• Should a deadline be imposed on the task of coming up with an implementable new search solution or would this be a vote to simply add "search bar improvements" to the list of changes those teams are allowed to enact at any time (after consulting with each other), with no deadline for any specific decisions?

• Is there anything else that needs to be addressed before we can move forward with this?

Re: Fixing Site Search

ProcyonLotor 19 Mar 2019 02:04

Will write a longer post later, but:

Which team would take the lead on this and be ultimately responsible for the resultant solution, its implementation, and its upkeep?

Tech, with CO input. Community Outreach has only a fairly short list of requirements ("make site content findable"), and maybe a few "would like to have"s. Development, implementation, and maintenance (such as there is) is entirely beyond our team's capabilities.

Re: Fixing Site Search

TSATPWTCOTTTADC 19 Apr 2019 19:05

Hi we have reworked wikidot servers infrastructure. Search server seems to work much better now.

_{Bartłomiej Bąkowski @ Wikidot Inc. - 22 Mar 2019 - http://feedback.wikidot.com/bug:1238}

Since that post went up I haven't had any failed searches and haven't heard reports of failed searches from anyone.

ETA: I just got one "Search failed. Please try again later." This seems to be rare, though.

Last edited on 19 Apr 2019 19:27 by TSATPWTCOTTTADC Show more

Re: Fixing Site Search

Jacob Conwell 19 Apr 2019 20:53

I guess that settles that for the time being. Do we want to continue to look into alternatives to implement, or are we just calling this good until further notice?

Re: Fixing Site Search

Modern_Erasmus 19 Apr 2019 21:02

Probably good until further notice imo.