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		<title>[DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules</title>
		<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules</link>
		<description>Posts in the discussion thread &quot;[DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules&quot;</description>
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5667051</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5667051</link>
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				<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2022 18:55:21 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>stormfallen</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>2782824</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Voting thread: <a href="http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15297137/voting-art-page-rules-clarification">http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15297137/voting-art-page-rules-clarification</a></p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5622205</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5622205</link>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 14:33:13 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>stormfallen</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>2782824</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>The more I think on this the more I feel we may have moved too fast in beginning to allow AI-generated content on the site, and at the very least we need clear advice from Licensing on their stance.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5622115</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5622115</link>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 12:59:42 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Ethagon</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5844683</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Generally in favour. I'd personally replace &quot;art pages&quot; with <tt>artist</tt> and <tt>artwork</tt> pages for clarity, unless we've define art pages somewhere.</p> <p>I'm a bit unsure about whether or not <tt>artist</tt> pages shouldn't be allowed to have a small section featuring art not made by them, because I understood them as the equivalent of author pages to artists.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5622107</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5622107</link>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 12:55:37 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Ethagon</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5844683</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>A thread is a good idea if someone wants to have a place to share SCP AI art.</p> <p>For me, the main difference between 6000-Jay and Ai art is that I fear the voting method might break down for the latter. While reposting public domain works is blatantly obvious in what they are, this isn't the case for AI art, which can look like normal art for someone who doesn't know how to spot the difference between the two. I'm against fully AI-generated texts as articles for similar reasons, but that's outside this discussion.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5622097</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5622097</link>
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				<pubDate>Thu, 06 Oct 2022 12:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Ethagon</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5844683</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>I think it should be a case-by-case thing. The upper bound is the same as when I take artwork from someone else and edit it heavily. If it comes up we can discuss it then.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621172</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621172</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 18:00:09 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>stormfallen</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>2782824</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Would an AI image which has been similarly heavily edited be allowed as an art page? What is the line for what's sufficiently the work of the poster?</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621142</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621142</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 17:14:47 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>OriTiefling</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>7454631</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>In favor. There is a morality discussion for AI artwork, but it isn't relevant here. Art pages are for art the user created themselves, full stop.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621103</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621103</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>GremlinGroup</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5287352</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>I believe it's worth noting for posterity that the <a href="https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/image-use-policy">Image Policy</a> does take some steps above the CC license:</p> <blockquote> <p>Images of excessive nudity/pornography and/or excessive gore are not allowed. What counts as excessive nudity/pornography and/or excessive gore will be decided on a case-by-case basis by SCP Foundation Wiki Staff.</p> </blockquote> <p>The image policy stands atop the CC requirement, it doesn't just restate it. The recent (quiet) addition of the Midjourney paid AI Generation service to the whitelist became an outlier to a caveat which (at the time) said:</p> <blockquote> <p>Images that are AI generated are not allowed.</p> </blockquote> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621097</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621097</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:35:56 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Prime Girl</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>4748297</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <div class="collapsible-block"> <div class="collapsible-block-folded"><a class="collapsible-block-link" href="javascript:;">+&nbsp;Old&nbsp;Thoughts&nbsp;on&nbsp;the&nbsp;matter</a></div> <div class="collapsible-block-unfolded" style="display:none"> <div class="collapsible-block-unfolded-link"><a class="collapsible-block-link" href="javascript:;">-&nbsp;Garbage&nbsp;In&nbsp;Garbage&nbsp;Out</a></div> <div class="collapsible-block-content"> <p>In favor of lack of AI art pages.<br /> Unsure about the commissioning bit.<br /> It does seem like a natural extension of the logic for banning AI images from being on art pages, in that in both cases the art page creator is not the art creator, but I am hesitant to lump those both together.</p> </div> </div> </div> <p>Edit: I did see user My Off Day suggest confining AI images that one would otherwise put on an art page to be in an AI Images thread of sorts, which could potentially be a decent compromise?</p> <p>Edit 2: stormfallen said something I found very interesting elsewhere, which got me thinking in a different light about this, which boils down to asking:</p> <div class="collapsible-block"> <div class="collapsible-block-folded"><a class="collapsible-block-link" href="javascript:;">+&nbsp;Collapsed&nbsp;because&nbsp;this&nbsp;was&nbsp;a&nbsp;bit&nbsp;long!</a></div> <div class="collapsible-block-unfolded" style="display:none"> <div class="collapsible-block-unfolded-link"><a class="collapsible-block-link" href="javascript:;">-&nbsp;Oh&nbsp;no!</a></div> <div class="collapsible-block-content"> <p>What separates minimally-edited public domain works of writing from minimally-edited AI artwork?</p> <p>Which I had not thought about, but i do fond it to be similar, in that things like 6000-Jay exist, and Bomb-J, are/were both Public Domain works, (or majoritarily), but they do not take away value from other -Js by their existence, or at least I do not think so.</p> <p>Point being!</p> <p>My kneejerk reaction to these debates were respectively to support things like 6000-Jay being allowed on site, but that AI generated images do not belong in an art page.</p> <p>And storm's line of questioning has made me think that this should not be so, as the core issue is the same (or very similar).</p> </div> </div> </div> <p>So now I am on the fence, though leaning a bit towards thinking things like public domain works and AI images in art pages do not require staff intervention at this time.</p> <p>Anyway, I am interested to know what people think about the similarity or difference between the core issues in allowing public domain writings on the site and allowing AI images in art pages, especially if you think, like I did, that one is okay while the other is not. :)</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621094</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621094</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:32:09 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Rounderhouse</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>4187885</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>I see no reason why that would even apply here? That's images used on articles, not <em>art pages</em>, which is what this discussion is about &#8212; and our policy there has always been if it's released under CC, you can use it in an article.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621088</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621088</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:29:48 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Rounderhouse</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>4187885</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>in favor. not for any moralistic stance, just a pragmatic one that i think allowing AI artpages would cause an influx of low-quality art pages whose licensing status is Questionable</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621081</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621081</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:28:04 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Assistant Null</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>2890907</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Yeah, agreed. And from the conversation, I do not believe that there should be a separate category made for just AI art. That will still detract from artists and commissions.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621079</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621079</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:27:01 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Rounderhouse</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>4187885</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>fwiw my understanding is that both of those had to go <em>heavy</em> editing to resemble anything remotely readable, so I'd say no based on Pure Vibes</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621074</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621074</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:24:53 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>stormfallen</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>2782824</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Would we be applying the same logic to written works like <a href="https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-botnik-j">SCP-\̅\̅\̅\̅-J</a> and <a href="https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/pounded">Pounded in the Butt by the Screaming Gristle Beacon from Site-Everything</a>?</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621071</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621071</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:24:09 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Agent Whitney</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5252186</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>I believe that we should disallow AI generated work on art pages. Ai work is currently a large point of discussion in a lot of art circles at the moment and while its extremely interesting what a computer is capable of creating these are computers creating these works not artists. The point of an art page is to see what someone has created. I don't think seeing what someone's computer has created is any sort of reflection upon the artist. Part of the attraction to AI art is it mimics art and potentially could confuse someone in to thinking its art. Not only that but Ai art work takes away commissions from artists. If people opt to use Ai art in there articles then people may neglect to commission are communities artist.</p> <p>Inputing a promot into an Ai takes a few seconds while drawing can take days or even months. To me it dosnt feel fair to are artist to allow Ai work on the same platform as them where allowing it can actively hurt them. Ai work in this community seems like it will do far more harm than good.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621064</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621064</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:16:37 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Marceline_Raynes</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5722579</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>I agree with this, as well as Nico's point about art being a demonstration of the user's artistic ability rather than inputs into an AI or commissioning someone to do the work for you</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621063</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621063</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:16:09 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>DrClef</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>213153</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Only if this is explicitly limited to Art Pages, not to SCP Articles themselves. Several articles on the website make use of commissioned artworks used with permission from the original artist.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621062</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621062</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:15:26 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Siddartha Alonne</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>6459894</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>Yeah there's like. Zero reasons this shouldn't be added.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621061</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621061</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:15:25 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>basirskipreader</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>6657366</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>will second this change, would clarify a bit that the commissioner is the one not allowed to post the artwork, but otherwise a-okay for me. putting prompts on an ai you didnt create does not an artist make</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621059</guid>
				<title>Re: [DISCUSSION] Minor chage to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621059</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:10:37 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>Uncle Nicolini</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>3487700</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>i agree with this clause. art pages should be a display of one's skill, not a display of one's ability to input good prompts into a bot.</p> 
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				<guid>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525#post-5621053</guid>
				<title>[DISCUSSION] Minor change to art page rules</title>
				<link>http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272525/discussion-minor-change-to-art-page-rules#post-5621053</link>
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				<pubDate>Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:06:54 +0000</pubDate>
				<wikidot:authorName>psychicprogrammer</wikidot:authorName>				<wikidot:authorUserId>5299606</wikidot:authorUserId>				<content:encoded>
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						 <p>04 link: <a href="https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272531/discussion-minor-chage-to-art-page-rules">https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/forum/t-15272531/discussion-minor-chage-to-art-page-rules</a></p> <p>Discord discussion link: <a href="https://discord.com/channels/757669801836413003/1004444741573808169/1027237134370865152">https://discord.com/channels/757669801836413003/1004444741573808169/1027237134370865152</a></p> <p>Due to some discussion on art pages it seems sensible to add the following text to our rules on creating art pages:</p> <p>&quot;All art pages must be primarily created by the poster and as such cannot be works you commissioned (as in someone else made the work for you) or AI generated work. However if you are not the artist you can post on behalf of the artist with explicit written permission .&quot;</p> <p>This discussion will go one for one week</p> <p><iframe src="https://scpwiki.github.io/timer/timer.html?lang=en&amp;time=2022-10-12T16%3A06%3A27.111Z" align="" frameborder="" height="" scrolling="" width="" class="" style="width: 750px; height: 200px; border: 0; text-align: center;"></iframe></p> 
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