Kritzsie

Summary:

Warning.

Kritzsie

RJB_R 20 Jan 2014 03:46

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[22:35:46] <Kritzsie> Ｉ’ｌｌ　ａｐｏｌｏｇｉｓｅ　ｉｎ　ａｄｖａｎｃｅ．．．　Ｉ　ａｍ　ｓｏ　ｓｏｒｒｙ！
[22:35:49] <Kritzsie> http://kiserai.net/hwfw.pl
[22:35:58] <MrCarbon> Zyn: DO IT! ONLY MY VOTE COUNTS
[22:35:59] <MrCarbon> ….
[22:36:04] <DrRobWatson> And I - oh god what now
[22:36:06] <MrCarbon> not even clicking that link
[22:36:16] <Vince|Drawing> Kritzsie ?
[22:36:30] <Gaffsey> yeah, that totally doesn't seem sketch as fuck
[22:36:40] <DrRobWatson> -_-
[22:36:45] <Kritzsie> No? Is everyone still okay?
[22:36:49] <Zyn> …Has anyone seen this Kritzsie before?
[22:36:58] * Djoric (~PI.AC636487.5239220B.BC0A4A81|alliztahc#PI.AC636487.5239220B.BC0A4A81|alliztahc) has joined
[22:37:05] * ShangXiao has kicked Kritzsie from #site19 (You know better)
[22:37:07] <DrRobWatson> Kritzsie well I just did
[22:37:10] <Tuomey> What the fuck was that link
[22:37:12] * Kritzsie (~moc.683D8D0E-CRInys|lessauq#moc.683D8D0E-CRInys|lessauq) has joined
[22:37:21] <Kritzsie> Ouch!
[22:37:22] <DrRobWatson> Emm… nothing wrong about the link
[22:37:30] <Gaffsey> ahahahaha I like that this would be the /actual/ reaction to one of those creepypasta scenarios
[22:37:33] * ShangXiao ain't playing.
[22:37:33] <DrRobWatson> It just converts a simple string
[22:37:38] <Roget> Kritzsie, do shit like that again and you'll probably get a tempban
[22:37:39] <Roget> kapish?
[22:37:40] <Vince|Drawing> Tuomey I like functioning computers a bit much
[22:37:43] <MrCarbon> $10 on Kritzsie being a bot
[22:37:44] <MrCarbon> :P
[22:37:47] Magnobile Milly MisterFlames MrCarbon Muaddib murphy_slaw
[22:37:49] <Kritzsie> wait what
[22:37:50] <ShangXiao> MRCarbon, don't start.
[22:37:52] <Gaffsey> rather than "ooooh let's click on the link the random stranger posted and said mysterious things about"
[22:37:55] <DrRobWatson> To a full string like the one posted above
[22:37:56] <Kritzsie> What *did* I do?
[22:38:03] <Gaffsey> "fuck, no!"
[22:38:22] <MrCarbon> Sorry, Xiao. I won't run a book here. ;)
[22:38:36] <Roget> Kritzsie, you did weird ass text and posted a mysterious link without giving context. We kicked you for it. That is your warning. It's disruptive to do those things.
[22:38:48] <Roget> Do it again and you will be temporarily removed from chat.
[22:38:49] <DrRobWatson> Ｉｔ　ｊｕｓｔ　ｄｏｅｓ　ｔｈｉｓ
[22:39:13] <DrRobWatson> Oh well Roget's got a point.
[22:39:15] <Tuomey> Note that if you just explain what you're linking people won't freak out so much
[22:39:25] <Tuomey> And everything will be fine
[22:39:38] * Roget has kicked DrRobWatson from #site19 (you /just/ saw me warn somebody for doing that shit, dude. )
[22:39:39] * DrRobWatson (~PI.DE4E55D2.6E1E4BE1.F700EEFF|diordnA#PI.DE4E55D2.6E1E4BE1.F700EEFF|diordnA) has joined
[22:39:56] <DrRobWatson> OK man sorry
[22:40:14] <Kritzsie> Shouldn't somebody be adding that to the rules right about now?
[22:40:41] * Magnolia (PI.32735173.1E9B6998.72B6CE89|tibbiM#PI.32735173.1E9B6998.72B6CE89|tibbiM) has joined
[22:40:46] <ShangXiao> It's already covered under common sense and Wheaton's law.
[22:40:54] <Roget> Kritzsie, it's disruptive. We've warned you and told you why. Please drop the conversation, and let's move on.

For the record, the link makes any text into the font he was posting with.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Last edited on 20 Jan 2014 03:47 by RJB_R Show more

Re: Kritzsie

thedeadlymoose 20 Jan 2014 04:13

Wait, what? What exactly did this person do wrong? And what exactly did DrRobWatson do? Please explain, because I'm not buying the explanation I see in the logs. I'm looking for disruption, but I ain't seeing it.

Re: Kritzsie

Communism will win 20 Jan 2014 04:19

Yeah. I mean, srsly guise? I've done more inexplicable stuff in 19 plenty of times before and nobody's given me shit about it, but suddenly y'all come down on this person like a ton of bricks.

Y'all need to take a damn chill pill.

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if your reading this your gay

Re: Kritzsie

Eskobar 20 Jan 2014 04:16

As I said in SSSC, I can't really agree with this one. People overreacted to Kritzsie's link, someone jumped into SSSC to request an op, Xiao jumped in and kicked immediately. I…suppose the link sort of looked sketchy, and Kritzsie could have explained better, but I wouldn't say any of it is

covered under common sense and Wheaton's law.

as Xiao put it. The link was literally just a text-spacer-outer, nothing malicious or obscene, nothing intrinsically disruptive. People aren't typically required to literally describe the content of every link they post, in reaction to an expectation that people will assume it's a virus unless told otherwise. It seems to me that they were kicked because of the way other people reacted unnecessarily to the link, and then Watson was kicked to be supportive of the Kritszie kick (which is a little more understandable).

For comparison (posting "weird ass text", as Roget put it), do we need to start kicking for weird ass emoticons of people flipping over tables? Kritzsie asked if a rule would be added to the Chat Guide; if that's something we're interested in in this case, what is that rule supposed to be, and what is the purpose for it?

EDIT: Wrote this immediately after the first post was made and didn't realize I hadn't posted it. Don't want to sound like I'm dogpiling just because Moose spoke up.

Last edited on 20 Jan 2014 04:23 by Eskobar Show more

Re: Kritzsie

RJB_R 20 Jan 2014 04:24

I'll say that I wasn't paying attention for DrRobWatson, I thought he was being dumb and derpy with something I thought was disruptive, because I know him in other rooms and he tends to err on the side of derpy.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: Kritzsie

Tuomey Tombstone 20 Jan 2014 04:26

He made it sound like it was something bad - people reacted as if it was. Maybe we would've been a little better off figuring out the link first, but it was certainly disruptive if nothing else.
A slight overreaction, yes, but not a huge deal on either end when all's said and done

Re: Kritzsie

Eskobar 20 Jan 2014 04:45

I can never agree with kicking someone for "being disruptive" when the disruption comes from other people overreacting to an otherwise reasonable action, though. Posting a link isn't disruptive, but everyone in 19 freaking out and calling for ops was the disruption.

Re: Kritzsie

FlameShirt 20 Jan 2014 05:19

If some does something that causes the freaking out, then they are the root cause.

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butts

Re: Kritzsie

Eskobar 20 Jan 2014 05:23

Incidentally and in a technical sense, yes, but there's no need to blame them for nonmalicious behavior. We can't have a rule in 19 that says "don't do anything that might make other people overreact to you, because then you are responsible for the behavior of others".

Re: Kritzsie

thedeadlymoose 20 Jan 2014 05:27

Correct.

Re: Kritzsie

FlameShirt 20 Jan 2014 05:46

When someone says "sorry in advance" when doing something that always tends to rile people up, I really question if it was non-malicious or that they were unaware that people would react.

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butts

Re: Kritzsie

thedeadlymoose 20 Jan 2014 06:36

I think they were just being an idiot, and not in an excessive way that would merit punishment. The simple solution would be to allow them to talk longer before taking op action.

Re: Kritzsie

thedeadlymoose 20 Jan 2014 04:41

CONTEXT: http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-655569

Kritzsie does have an already existing O5 thread, so I can understand the suspicion.

THAT SAID: It is my opinion that this was an absolutely ridiculous situation. I'm not unsympathetic, given that I've recently had some overreactions myself (for example with the vezaz situation not so long ago).

However, that doesn't make it better.

What should have happened was that Kritzsie should have been given a chance to explain the link properly and clear up the confusion. No kicks. No warnings. No tempbans.

At most, if he refused to explain the shady link after given a chance, he could have been kicked for that, but no operator asked for an explanation. Xiao kicked him and Roget delivered the warning. This is not acceptable.

Kicking RobWatson for explaining was also not unacceptable. He broke no rules by changing his text whatsoever.

I am rescinding Kritzsie's warning for this. And guys, we've gotta really work on our collective over- and under-reaction to things. I don't want to undercut you guys, but this is the makings of a serious issue.

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I've publicly apologized to RobWatson and sent Kritzsie an apology as well. Logs from 19:

Display Logs

[20:44] =-= Mode #site19 +m by thedeadlymoose
[20:44] thedeadlymoose Sorry, let me interrupt conversation.
[20:44] thedeadlymoose http://05command.wikidot.com/forum/t-764994/kritzsie#post-1940476
[20:45] thedeadlymoose I want to publicly apologize on behalf of #site19 ops for warning Kritzsie and kicking RobWatson for essentially zero reason.
[20:45] thedeadlymoose We'll endeavor to ensure that doesn't happen again.
[20:45] =-= Mode #site19 -m by thedeadlymoose
[20:45] TroyL Ａｎｄ　ｍｙ　ｐｒｏｔｅｓｔ　ｅｎｄｓ．　Ｎｅｖｅｒ　ｌｅｔ　ｉｔ　ｂｅ　ｓａｉｄ　ｔｈａｔ　ｐａｓｓｉｖｅ　ｒｅｓｉｓｔａｎｃｅ　ｎｅｖｅｒ　ｓｏｌｖｅｄ　ａｎｙｔｈｉｎｇ．
[20:45] Jabonicus DAMNIT TROYL
[20:45] TroyL I will now quit hurting all your eyes.
[20:46] thedeadlymoose .tell Kritzsie We have rescinded your warning. I apologize on behalf of everyone for warning/kicking you for essentially no reason — we'll endeavor to see that it doesn't happen again.
[20:46] DrRobWatson Do not worry man. I know sometimes things are not what they appear
[20:46] Nala thedeadlymoose: I'll pass that along.
[20:46] thedeadlymoose Rob, honestly, I think we all just got confused.
[20:47] MrCarbon I was a bit surprised that he was kicked, I just was suspicious of the link because I'm an old Internet cynic.
[20:47] DrRobWatson I was trying to explain what the link was
[20:47] MrCarbon But I don't make the decisions on policy here — happily! — so I'll just leave all that to those that do.
[20:47] TroyL You were! And now, I'm giving you snuggles for it. Be prepared. :|
[20:47] TroyL Are you prepared yet?
[20:47] bluesoul DrRobWatson what are you doing, this is a rare chance to gloat at the ops, maybe do the helicopter dick at them
[20:47] TroyL snuggles DrRobWatson.
[20:47] TroyL Yessss.
[20:47] TroyL ends the snuggling session.
[20:47] TroyL goes and has a beer.
[20:48] Roget DrRobWatson, sorry for kicking you. I wasn't paying attention, and random weird text is usually not a harbringer of good times
[20:48] DrRobWatson I know, don't worry
[20:48] thedeadlymoose [20:47] MrCarbon But I don't make the decisions on policy here — happily! — so I'll just leave all that to those that do. > Dissent is always allowed in 19 so long as it's not disruptive, and if someone says it's disruptive when it's not, let me know and I'll take care of it best I can.
[20:49] MrCarbon sure thing, thedeadlymoose
[20:49] DrRobWatson In my android app that text w a s j u s t l i k e t h i s
[20:49] thedeadlymoose Even if it's me shutting it down, I'll take it into consideration for when I'm not 'in the moment' anymore
[20:49] thedeadlymoose definitely not free of guilt in these kinds of situations
[20:49] DrRobWatson Nothing unusual, so I was actually surprised… but no problem

Last edited on 20 Jan 2014 04:55 by thedeadlymoose Show more

Re: Kritzsie

(account deleted) 20 Jan 2014 05:27

I'll take up the blame - I hopped in (on my break from work) and was getting pinged right away to see what's up.

Re: Kritzsie

FlameShirt 20 Jan 2014 05:41

This seemed like an entirely reasonable course of action. Text manipulation always tends to rile people up because of the association with bots and spam, and the message to me seemed like they were obviously doing it for a reaction. A kick and a warning seems completely fine to me in this situation.

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butts

Re: Kritzsie

marslifeform 20 Jan 2014 07:37

I would disagree with you here. "Weird text" is not always indicative of such things, and if it was, it would be pretty easy to tell it wasn't the case when the user started responding in a non-bot/spam way. Plus, I think that "riling up a reaction" shouldn't necessarily be criterion for disrupting chat (for example, linking a draft hopes to ellict a response for people to critique, or linking some sort of news article is usually linked in order to start a discussion of some sort). The user seemed to clearly just be trying to show chat something that amused them personally, rather than to disrupt the flow of chat (even with the admittedly worrying preceding statement). I know chOPs have been trying to use kicking more as a method of warning, but this seems really extreme, especially given that the link was really harmless (was it even checked before the kick?). In my opinion, a gun was jumped here and caused more of a scene than the stimulus.

/non-chOP $0.02

Re: Kritzsie

thedeadlymoose 20 Jan 2014 08:09

As I said above & elsewhere, I disagree; in these situations we should wait for the person to clarify. That will also help make it clear if they're being an idiot of the kind disruptive enough to merit booting.

Plus, bots and spam only actually disrupt the chat once they start spamming, or if they continually say stupid shit. This person wasn't given the chance to do either (or even to say nothing, which would also merit a kick to get their attention).

I'm willing to change my mind on this if a good enough case is made, but for the time being, always give the person sufficient chance to clarify, and then proceed as necessary.